Discussion:
Bill Lawrence Pickups
(too old to reply)
TheChris
2013-09-17 15:32:51 UTC
Permalink
Bill Lawrence Pickups - specifically L500XL's - I had a few in the early 90's, and they were by far my most favorite pickups. I made the mistake of selling them, but would like to find some now... I remember hearing about the confusion between who makes them, and who has the rights to the name. I've been all over the web and Ebay, and can't get a handle on it all. I know Bill sold the name at least in '85 - but, where should I go NOW if I want good BL pickups like the ones I had in the 90's? Amazon has them, but they get terrible reviews... What to do?? Thanks.
Bruce Morgen
2013-09-17 16:06:00 UTC
Permalink
Post by TheChris
Bill Lawrence Pickups - specifically L500XL's - I had a few in the early 90's, and they were by far my most favorite pickups. I made the mistake of selling them, but would like to find some now... I remember hearing about the confusion between who makes them, and who has the rights to the name. I've been all over the web and Ebay, and can't get a handle on it all. I know Bill sold the name at least in '85 - but, where should I go NOW if I want good BL pickups like the ones I had in the 90's? Amazon has them, but they get terrible reviews... What to do?? Thanks.
There are a number of misconceptions
regarding this issue. First of all,
Bill NEVER sold his name or the
rights to use it, and he and his wife
are still making his pickups the
right way. Stay away from Amazon and
eBay and buy direct -- you will not
be disappointed. Here's the ordering
page for his twin-blade models -- the
website's not slick or fancy, but the
product is not only every bit as good
as what he made in the 1990s, these
days it's actually better:

<http://www.wildepickups.com/Wilde_Bill_s_Twin_Blades.html>

Keep in mind that theirs is a small,
family-run shop, so it's fairly rare
for anything to be in stock for
immediate delivery -- last time I
checked, the lead time was 3-4 weeks,
but that varies depending on what
model is being built on the day you
order.
Nil
2013-09-17 16:34:45 UTC
Permalink
Post by Bruce Morgen
There are a number of misconceptions
regarding this issue. First of all,
Bill NEVER sold his name or the
rights to use it, and he and his wife
are still making his pickups the
right way. Stay away from Amazon and
eBay and buy direct -- you will not
be disappointed. Here's the ordering
page for his twin-blade models -- the
website's not slick or fancy, but the
product is not only every bit as good
as what he made in the 1990s, these
<http://www.wildepickups.com/Wilde_Bill_s_Twin_Blades.html>
I used a Lawrence single-blade Strat pickup in the late '70s. I liked
it a lot at the time.
Bruce Morgen
2013-09-17 17:13:07 UTC
Permalink
Post by Nil
Post by Bruce Morgen
There are a number of misconceptions
regarding this issue. First of all,
Bill NEVER sold his name or the
rights to use it, and he and his wife
are still making his pickups the
right way. Stay away from Amazon and
eBay and buy direct -- you will not
be disappointed. Here's the ordering
page for his twin-blade models -- the
website's not slick or fancy, but the
product is not only every bit as good
as what he made in the 1990s, these
<http://www.wildepickups.com/Wilde_Bill_s_Twin_Blades.html>
I used a Lawrence single-blade Strat pickup in the late '70s. I liked
it a lot at the time.
His current twin-blade for
Strats, the L-45S, is even
better.
TheChris
2013-09-18 09:27:42 UTC
Permalink
Post by Bruce Morgen
There are a number of misconceptions
regarding this issue. First of all,
Bill NEVER sold his name or the
rights to use it, and he and his wife
are still making his pickups the
right way. Stay away from Amazon and
eBay and buy direct -- you will not
be disappointed. Here's the ordering
page for his twin-blade models -- the
website's not slick or fancy, but the
product is not only every bit as good
as what he made in the 1990s, these
<http://www.wildepickups.com/Wilde_Bill_s_Twin_Blades.html>
Keep in mind that theirs is a small,
family-run shop, so it's fairly rare
for anything to be in stock for
immediate delivery -- last time I
checked, the lead time was 3-4 weeks,
but that varies depending on what
model is being built on the day you
order.
Well, that's quite a misconception - wouldn't you say?? :) I went to Amazon and looked. Surely, they had 'Official' BL pickups, but, the reviews were horrible, and somebody mentioned that they were NOT what they said they were. I DID find the site, and ordered a pickup. Should be home by the time I get there... Thanks!!!
Bruce Morgen
2013-09-18 21:28:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by TheChris
Post by Bruce Morgen
There are a number of misconceptions
regarding this issue. First of all,
Bill NEVER sold his name or the
rights to use it, and he and his wife
are still making his pickups the
right way. Stay away from Amazon and
eBay and buy direct -- you will not
be disappointed. Here's the ordering
page for his twin-blade models -- the
website's not slick or fancy, but the
product is not only every bit as good
as what he made in the 1990s, these
<http://www.wildepickups.com/Wilde_Bill_s_Twin_Blades.html>
Keep in mind that theirs is a small,
family-run shop, so it's fairly rare
for anything to be in stock for
immediate delivery -- last time I
checked, the lead time was 3-4 weeks,
but that varies depending on what
model is being built on the day you
order.
Well, that's quite a misconception - wouldn't you say?? :)
Indeed I would.
Post by TheChris
I went to Amazon and looked. Surely, they had 'Official' BL pickups, but, the reviews were horrible, and somebody mentioned that they were NOT what they said they were. I DID find the site, and ordered a pickup. Should be home by the time I get there... Thanks!!!
You're more than welcome --
just for fun, here's a body
shot of "Tuxedo," my Squier
'51 partscaster with a
zebra/chrome L-500L is the
bridge position -- the neck
pickup is a Fender SCN,
also designed by Bill:

<Loading Image...
RS
2013-09-24 06:05:35 UTC
Permalink
Post by Bruce Morgen
There are a number of misconceptions
regarding this issue. First of all,
Bill NEVER sold his name or the
rights to use it, and he and his wife
are still making his pickups the
right way.
Bruce, You've dealt with Bill directly. Can you shed some light on
that? When I've spoken to Bill about the other (fake) "Bill Lawrence"
pickups, I got the impression that he had no legal recourse. That
certainly wouldn't be the case unless there was some type of
licensing. (I don't think I could open a "MacDonalds" without some
kind of clearance)

I believe the 'fake' pickups were even sold by Stew-Mac, were they
not?

Incidentally, I've always liked Lawrence pickups. Back when everyone
was looking for hum-cancelling strat pickups, I thought Bill's sounded
very much like a natural strat pickup. Not the case for Kinmans,
Dimarzios, and the rest of 'em.
Bruce Morgen
2013-09-24 14:55:44 UTC
Permalink
Post by RS
Post by Bruce Morgen
There are a number of misconceptions
regarding this issue. First of all,
Bill NEVER sold his name or the
rights to use it, and he and his wife
are still making his pickups the
right way.
Bruce, You've dealt with Bill directly. Can you shed some light on
that? When I've spoken to Bill about the other (fake) "Bill Lawrence"
pickups, I got the impression that he had no legal recourse. That
certainly wouldn't be the case unless there was some type of
licensing. (I don't think I could open a "MacDonalds" without some
kind of clearance)
There was a lawsuit over the
matter -- it ended with huge
attorney fees and an out-of-
court settlement under the
auspices of a since-retired
federal magistrate judge that
runs afoul of the Lanham Act
(the foundation of U.S.
trademark law) and is
therefore unenforceable.

There might be one more legal
wrestling match over the name
when Bill passes away, but
suffice it to say Wajcman (a
former associate of Bill's)
unilaterally appropriated the
name and there was never any
sort of long-term licensing
transaction. In fact,
Wajcman submitted a forged
document (a limited-term
license with the term whited
out and xeroxed) during the
court proceeding -- a de
facto admission that he had
never received the requisite
permission.
Post by RS
I believe the 'fake' pickups were even sold by Stew-Mac, were they
not?
Until Stew-Mac got wind of
the controversy and dropped
them like a hot potato, yes.
I'm pretty sure MF still
carries them, although I'm
less sure that Wajcman is
still among the living,
since nobody has seen hide
nor hair of him for many a
month. At this point, I
think dealers are mostly
trying to unload old stock
of his crap via eBay and
Amazon, hence the fuktonne
of negative reviews posted
on the latter.
Post by RS
Incidentally, I've always liked Lawrence pickups. Back when everyone
was looking for hum-cancelling strat pickups, I thought Bill's sounded
very much like a natural strat pickup. Not the case for Kinmans,
Dimarzios, and the rest of 'em.
His current stuff along
those lines is even better
-- I like his "airgap
noisefree" models better
than single-coils myself,
and his L-45 Strat-sized
twin-blades (which I
haven't tried yet) are
said to be just as good,
if not superior. I use
his pickups in all my
guitars, FWIW -- given the
sky-high quality-to-price
ratio, I haven't come up
with a reason to look
elsewhere.
JNugent
2013-09-24 18:43:19 UTC
Permalink
Post by RS
Post by Bruce Morgen
There are a number of misconceptions
regarding this issue. First of all,
Bill NEVER sold his name or the
rights to use it, and he and his wife
are still making his pickups the
right way.
Bruce, You've dealt with Bill directly. Can you shed some light on
that? When I've spoken to Bill about the other (fake) "Bill Lawrence"
pickups, I got the impression that he had no legal recourse. That
certainly wouldn't be the case unless there was some type of
licensing. (I don't think I could open a "MacDonalds" without some
kind of clearance)
I believe the 'fake' pickups were even sold by Stew-Mac, were they
not?
Incidentally, I've always liked Lawrence pickups. Back when everyone
was looking for hum-cancelling strat pickups, I thought Bill's sounded
very much like a natural strat pickup. Not the case for Kinmans,
Dimarzios, and the rest of 'em.
The down-market version of Bill Lawrence pickups was, I'm sure I recall,
the OBL line.

Gibson used them on at least two Epiphones, and the Johnny Smith-type
floater on the Epi Emperor Regent was originally supposed to be an OBL.
It was a terrible pickup of its type, no competition whatever for a
properly-made example (like a USA Gibson, Kent Armstrong or similar).
Bruce Morgen
2013-09-24 19:03:54 UTC
Permalink
Post by JNugent
Post by RS
Post by Bruce Morgen
There are a number of misconceptions
regarding this issue. First of all,
Bill NEVER sold his name or the
rights to use it, and he and his wife
are still making his pickups the
right way.
Bruce, You've dealt with Bill directly. Can you shed some light on
that? When I've spoken to Bill about the other (fake) "Bill Lawrence"
pickups, I got the impression that he had no legal recourse. That
certainly wouldn't be the case unless there was some type of
licensing. (I don't think I could open a "MacDonalds" without some
kind of clearance)
I believe the 'fake' pickups were even sold by Stew-Mac, were they
not?
Incidentally, I've always liked Lawrence pickups. Back when everyone
was looking for hum-cancelling strat pickups, I thought Bill's sounded
very much like a natural strat pickup. Not the case for Kinmans,
Dimarzios, and the rest of 'em.
The down-market version of Bill Lawrence pickups was, I'm sure I recall,
the OBL line.
Gibson used them on at least two Epiphones, and the Johnny Smith-type
floater on the Epi Emperor Regent was originally supposed to be an OBL.
It was a terrible pickup of its type, no competition whatever for a
properly-made example (like a USA Gibson, Kent Armstrong or similar).
I don't think this has anything
to do with the issue at hand --
Wajcman didn't appropriate the
name until the 1980s and AFAIK
never used the "OBL" brand.
JNugent
2013-09-24 19:08:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by Bruce Morgen
Post by JNugent
Post by RS
Post by Bruce Morgen
There are a number of misconceptions
regarding this issue. First of all,
Bill NEVER sold his name or the
rights to use it, and he and his wife
are still making his pickups the
right way.
Bruce, You've dealt with Bill directly. Can you shed some light on
that? When I've spoken to Bill about the other (fake) "Bill Lawrence"
pickups, I got the impression that he had no legal recourse. That
certainly wouldn't be the case unless there was some type of
licensing. (I don't think I could open a "MacDonalds" without some
kind of clearance)
I believe the 'fake' pickups were even sold by Stew-Mac, were they
not?
Incidentally, I've always liked Lawrence pickups. Back when everyone
was looking for hum-cancelling strat pickups, I thought Bill's sounded
very much like a natural strat pickup. Not the case for Kinmans,
Dimarzios, and the rest of 'em.
The down-market version of Bill Lawrence pickups was, I'm sure I recall,
the OBL line.
Gibson used them on at least two Epiphones, and the Johnny Smith-type
floater on the Epi Emperor Regent was originally supposed to be an OBL.
It was a terrible pickup of its type, no competition whatever for a
properly-made example (like a USA Gibson, Kent Armstrong or similar).
I don't think this has anything
to do with the issue at hand --
Wajcman didn't appropriate the
name until the 1980s and AFAIK
never used the "OBL" brand.
OK.
Bruce Morgen
2013-09-24 19:16:27 UTC
Permalink
Post by Bruce Morgen
Post by JNugent
Post by RS
Post by Bruce Morgen
There are a number of misconceptions
regarding this issue. First of all,
Bill NEVER sold his name or the
rights to use it, and he and his wife
are still making his pickups the
right way.
Bruce, You've dealt with Bill directly. Can you shed some light on
that? When I've spoken to Bill about the other (fake) "Bill Lawrence"
pickups, I got the impression that he had no legal recourse. That
certainly wouldn't be the case unless there was some type of
licensing. (I don't think I could open a "MacDonalds" without some
kind of clearance)
I believe the 'fake' pickups were even sold by Stew-Mac, were they
not?
Incidentally, I've always liked Lawrence pickups. Back when everyone
was looking for hum-cancelling strat pickups, I thought Bill's sounded
very much like a natural strat pickup. Not the case for Kinmans,
Dimarzios, and the rest of 'em.
The down-market version of Bill Lawrence pickups was, I'm sure I recall,
the OBL line.
Gibson used them on at least two Epiphones, and the Johnny Smith-type
floater on the Epi Emperor Regent was originally supposed to be an OBL.
It was a terrible pickup of its type, no competition whatever for a
properly-made example (like a USA Gibson, Kent Armstrong or similar).
I don't think this has anything
to do with the issue at hand --
Wajcman didn't appropriate the
name until the 1980s and AFAIK
never used the "OBL" brand.
OK.
I do know that, like Larry
DiMarzio, Kent Armstrong
learned pretty much
everything he knows about
pickups from a de facto
apprenticeship with Bill
Lawrence in NYC -- and
that Bill designed the
pickup production line
that AFAIK Gibson still
uses today back in the
early 1970s.
JNugent
2013-09-24 19:24:41 UTC
Permalink
Post by Bruce Morgen
Post by JNugent
Post by RS
Post by Bruce Morgen
There are a number of misconceptions
regarding this issue. First of all,
Bill NEVER sold his name or the
rights to use it, and he and his wife
are still making his pickups the
right way.
Bruce, You've dealt with Bill directly. Can you shed some light on
that? When I've spoken to Bill about the other (fake) "Bill Lawrence"
pickups, I got the impression that he had no legal recourse. That
certainly wouldn't be the case unless there was some type of
licensing. (I don't think I could open a "MacDonalds" without some
kind of clearance)
I believe the 'fake' pickups were even sold by Stew-Mac, were they
not?
Incidentally, I've always liked Lawrence pickups. Back when everyone
was looking for hum-cancelling strat pickups, I thought Bill's sounded
very much like a natural strat pickup. Not the case for Kinmans,
Dimarzios, and the rest of 'em.
The down-market version of Bill Lawrence pickups was, I'm sure I recall,
the OBL line.
Gibson used them on at least two Epiphones, and the Johnny Smith-type
floater on the Epi Emperor Regent was originally supposed to be an OBL.
It was a terrible pickup of its type, no competition whatever for a
properly-made example (like a USA Gibson, Kent Armstrong or similar).
I don't think this has anything
to do with the issue at hand --
Wajcman didn't appropriate the
name until the 1980s and AFAIK
never used the "OBL" brand.
OK.
I do know that, like Larry DiMarzio, Kent Armstrong learned pretty much
everything he knows about pickups from a de facto apprenticeship with Bill
Lawrence in NYC -- and that Bill designed the pickup production line
that AFAIK Gibson still uses today back in the early 1970s.
That's some recommendation, because current Gibson pickup production is
as good as it has ever been.
Tony Done
2013-09-24 20:40:44 UTC
Permalink
Post by Bruce Morgen
Post by JNugent
Post by RS
Post by Bruce Morgen
There are a number of misconceptions
regarding this issue. First of all,
Bill NEVER sold his name or the
rights to use it, and he and his wife
are still making his pickups the
right way.
Bruce, You've dealt with Bill directly. Can you shed some light on
that? When I've spoken to Bill about the other (fake) "Bill Lawrence"
pickups, I got the impression that he had no legal recourse. That
certainly wouldn't be the case unless there was some type of
licensing. (I don't think I could open a "MacDonalds" without some
kind of clearance)
I believe the 'fake' pickups were even sold by Stew-Mac, were they
not?
Incidentally, I've always liked Lawrence pickups. Back when everyone
was looking for hum-cancelling strat pickups, I thought Bill's sounded
very much like a natural strat pickup. Not the case for Kinmans,
Dimarzios, and the rest of 'em.
The down-market version of Bill Lawrence pickups was, I'm sure I recall,
the OBL line.
Gibson used them on at least two Epiphones, and the Johnny Smith-type
floater on the Epi Emperor Regent was originally supposed to be an OBL.
It was a terrible pickup of its type, no competition whatever for a
properly-made example (like a USA Gibson, Kent Armstrong or similar).
I don't think this has anything
to do with the issue at hand --
Wajcman didn't appropriate the
name until the 1980s and AFAIK
never used the "OBL" brand.
OK.
This explains (maybe) the OBL thing:

http://www.billlawrence.com/Pages/About_Bill/BL_obl.htm
--
Tony Done

http://www.soundclick.com/bands/default.cfm?bandID=784456

http://www.flickr.com/photos/done_family/
west
2013-10-05 01:01:39 UTC
Permalink
Post by TheChris
Bill Lawrence Pickups - specifically L500XL's - I had a few in the early 90's, and they were by far my most favorite pickups. I made the mistake of selling them, but would like to find some now... I remember hearing about the confusion between who makes them, and who has the rights to the name. I've been all over the web and Ebay, and can't get a handle on it all. I know Bill sold the name at least in '85 - but, where should I go NOW if I want good BL pickups like the ones I had in the 90's? Amazon has them, but they get terrible reviews... What to do?? Thanks.
Call them up and talk to Becky.
I have 2 Strats and 3 Teles (one a Nashville) with Lawrence pups in them.
I haven't found anything better at any price.
The_Chris
2013-10-05 20:20:52 UTC
Permalink
Post by west
Post by TheChris
Bill Lawrence Pickups - specifically L500XL's - I had a few in the early 90's, and they were by far my most favorite pickups. I made the mistake of selling them, but would like to find some now... I remember hearing about the confusion between who makes them, and who has the rights to the name. I've been all over the web and Ebay, and can't get a handle on it all. I know Bill sold the name at least in '85 - but, where should I go NOW if I want good BL pickups like the ones I had in the 90's? Amazon has them, but they get terrible reviews... What to do?? Thanks.
Call them up and talk to Becky.
I have 2 Strats and 3 Teles (one a Nashville) with Lawrence pups in them.
I haven't found anything better at any price.
My L500XL is arriving tomorrow... I get home from Afghanistan on
Tuesday. Right after I kiss my wife, I'm going to throw that MF'er into
my Dean Flying Vee :)
Twibil
2013-10-07 05:44:12 UTC
Permalink
Post by The_Chris
My L500XL is arriving tomorrow... I get home from Afghanistan on
Tuesday. Right after I kiss my wife, I'm going to throw that MF'er into
my Dean Flying Vee :)
Only kiss? (We don't believe you.) XD

Welcome home!
%
2013-10-07 16:27:18 UTC
Permalink
Post by Twibil
Post by The_Chris
My L500XL is arriving tomorrow... I get home from Afghanistan on
Tuesday. Right after I kiss my wife, I'm going to throw that MF'er
into my Dean Flying Vee :)
Only kiss? (We don't believe you.) XD
Welcome home!
and you get ignored again

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